Seth: Hey everybody, how's it going? This is Seth Williams. You're listening to the REtipster podcast. This is episode 210. Show notes for today can be found at retipster.com/210.

Today, I'm talking with Robin Seib. Robin has been running onlinelandmarket.com, and it's a website where he does one thing: he sells land, and he sells it on behalf of other land investors who just don't want to do the work of selling or don't have time to do it. It's kind of a nice alternative on the disposition side of the business.

Selling land is something people have been having a harder time with this past year. Even if it wasn't something that people were having a hard time with, it's always an important thing to talk about in the land business. Because if you don't have the ability to sell or dispose of your properties quickly, things are going to be a lot harder than they need to be. After all, this is where all of our paydays come from.

So we're going to talk with Robin about his secret sauce for selling land. We'll talk about which listing sites are the most and least helpful and worth the time to list on, how to deal with Facebook Marketplace, Craigslist, and all kinds of stuff. We're going to get into it right now.

So Robin, welcome. How's it going?

Robin: Hey Seth, thank you for having me. To be honest, it's amazing. When I started my land flipping journey in 2020, I started listening to your podcast, and now I'm on here. Look at that. You have this radio broadcaster voice, right? I love that. I could probably play that for my baby to sleep sometimes to just calm them down. So thank you for having me today, man.

Seth: You know what's funny about that? Whenever I hear my voice in recordings, I can't stand it. It drives me crazy. But I have learned how to take this voice and kind of mold it into something that's somewhat palatable to the ear. So I appreciate you saying that.

Robin: I love it, man. It's good.

Seth: So let's get a quick history lesson from you. When did you first get into the land business? How did you even discover this land world?

Robin: Here's a brief bio. I was born and raised in Germany, which you probably hear from my accent. We live in Spain and in Dallas. My wife and I are married; we have a nine-month-old daughter and a cute little dog, and we travel between the continents because we're both big-time travelers. I've been in land since 2020, and before that, I was an entrepreneur for 15 years.

I was always in the real estate industry, first on the construction side and service side. In Germany, we do construction a little differently. We had an engineering firm, a funding firm, and a window and door company—all that kind of stuff that drove me crazy. In 2018, I ended up with burnout. It was pretty bad—I was three months out of life. You can't imagine. When we met a couple of times, normally I have energy and I'm always like, "Let's go!" But there were three months where I was just lying in bed. I didn't know what to do.

So I got out of that, sold my construction company I had at that time, and just said, "Okay, what do you do now?" Frank came up and said, "Hey, you want to do real estate investing with me?" I said, "Cool, yeah, let's do it. What do we do?" He said, "Let's flip houses." So we started flipping houses in Germany in 2018, which is completely different from here. We don't have direct mail. We don't have data. It was just like, man, you need to build relationships with realtors. You need to play a different game.

Robin: Our first year, I think we flipped 100 houses. In our second year, we flipped almost 300 houses. And with all that comes dealing with contractors, and contractors have this specific language. I mean, you know, you deal with contractors all day, and when you ask them when they'll be finished, they tell you "tomorrow," but they never exactly define which tomorrow they mean—tomorrow, in a week, in a month, in a year, in a decade.

After two years of doing that, I felt pretty burned out again or was pretty close, and I promised myself I would never get back in this dark place. So I went on a two-month leave to Australia. I had the opportunity to swap houses with some guys. I was two months on the beach, hanging out, kite surfing, swimming with dolphins, all this amazing stuff. I came back, told my partner, "I'm out." He said, "Are you crazy? Are you kidding me?" And I said, "Hey, I can't do this anymore. It's not good for my health."

He said, "Okay, but look, before you drop out of this partnership, there is this guy coming from the U.S. talking about land. And you can flip land in the U.S." I said, "Okay, can I do that from my laptop?" That was my first question. He said, "Yeah, from my understanding, you just do it from a laptop." I had never been in the U.S. I was speaking English pretty decently, but not on a business level.

That guy was Jack Bosch. I think he made one event in Germany in February 2020. I sat there for three days and thought, "Hey, you know what? That sounds amazing. You can do it from the laptop." And even if 10% of the outcomes that he was promoting were true—you know how that is when you sit in a coach event—I wanted to do this. So I enrolled in coaching. Then in April 2020, COVID hit, so I couldn't even travel to the U.S. We couldn't even open bank accounts.

I needed a year to do my first deal. Made $0 in profit on that. Made every mistake you can make. But guess what? We figured it out. In 2021, it was 65 deals. In 2022, it was around 300 deals. In 2023, I think it was 450. And this year, we'll probably be involved in like 600 transactions. I don't know where we'll be at the end of the year.

Today, we sell land for other land investors, as you mentioned. We still run our wholesale business. I run the land fund where we buy notes and fund deals on hard money loans. We have a development company, so we entitle deals for others. I don't do so many subdivides—I don't enjoy it so much, and I don't have really strong partners, but we do them. I think this year we did five minors and eight or nine major subdivides with partners together. Today we're deal facilitators. That's what I am. You have the land deal and you don't know what to do, or you're hanging around with it, and we can help you sell it, develop it, and fund it. That's what we do today.

Seth: Wow, I didn't realize you were doing so much stuff. You've got this note-buying thing and you've got a website for that too. What's that?

Robin: We do all that through thelandpilot.com right now for the partners we sell stuff to. It's an interesting thing—I got introduced to the concept of private money, and it's still like Alice in Wonderland sometimes doing business in the U.S. Everybody says it's so regulated and restricted. Hey, you have never done business in Europe before! Then you know what regulations and restrictions are.

Right now, we funnel everything through thelandpilot.com. We have a portal there where you can log in, submit your deals, or hit me up at onlinelandmarket.com if you have notes to sell or hard money loans to sell. I personally have a network of 250 private money lenders I work with frequently, where we funnel deals from all sides just to get it rolling. Because I feel, especially in this market, hard money and owner financing are exit strategies that are a must.

Seth: We're going to get into all that. I'm really curious to hear about that. So focusing on the sales side of things with the online land market, what gave you the idea to start focusing on this and start doing this on behalf of land investors? When or why did that become a thing you decided to go after?

Robin: It came out of the history. I told a little bit about the amount of deals we did. I focused pretty early on acquiring packages because I don't like the acquisition game of land; let me be honest about that. I don't like talking to hundreds of sellers and getting that one deal out of them. I said, "Why don't we just talk to one that has a lot of lots?"

This is how I learned about private money. The first package was 144 lots in 24 counties in Florida from one person, with one lender involved. I was sitting at my parents' house on Christmas 2021, typing comps, making comps on 144 lots across the state. They were everywhere, and there was everything from $5,000 lots to $500,000 lots in there. But that guy just wanted to get rid of it, and I said okay.

The whole transaction, I think I bought it for $300,000, and I was estimating to sell it off for $1.8-1.9 million, so I thought it was a great deal. I ended up selling it for $3 million at the peak of the market.

Seth: That's amazing.

Robin: Yeah, but the thing is, how do you get there? When you buy 144 lots, there is no buyer for 144 lots in a package. There are not that many mad people like me who take down a portfolio like this, so you can't just wholesale that. So I needed to build a reliable sales process. I needed to build something like, How do you do due diligence at scale, like on 144 lots? Because every day they're not in the market, they're not generating revenue. How do you create listings? How do you list them? You can't just go to land.com and buy a 144-lot land.com subscription because it's just expensive.

I hired a good CMO with a lot of experience with online marketing and sales teams and realtors. We built out this process really to do dispositions at scale. But we started selling and people were seeing it. So then that year, a lot of people asked, "How do you do so many deals?" I explained what we do, and they asked, "Can you sell my land for me?" I said yeah, straight up. We did 50-50 profits. We did 65 JVs that year.

I don't like JVs. I mean, it depends on who you're working with. But I had these discussions where people made like $50,000 of profit and they held up the closing process because the FedEx receipt of $21.43 was not part of the calculation.

So I said, "Okay, hey, I like that because obviously there's a need in the market." People don't want to do dispositions; they don't want to just rely on realtors. They want to get the whole process done. They don't even want to take care of anything. Let's build a product out of that. That was early 2023. So we started formatting the land pilot. And what it is, it's like we take wholesale deals, lots you own, and just sell it for you on a commission basis. That's the business model behind that.

Seth: I got like a million questions right now. I'm going to try to get this as organized as I can. So I heard you say earlier something about doing a 50-50 split on the profits. But then I just heard you say it's sold on a commission basis. So how do you make money? How much do you get paid? What does it cost the operator to use you to sell their property?

Robin: We started on a JV basis. It's too hard to maintain when you do hundreds of transactions. You just have three people calculating deals. Today, it's a little upfront fee, which generally covers a couple of things we do in the process. Because when I take over a property, there are two or three things that are not negotiable.

Robin: For a wholesale deal, we pull a title commitment, not just a title search. We pull a full commitment. I want to know, as the person who sells the property, can it sell tomorrow? I've personally been in a situation where you wholesale, sit at the closing table, you can't clear title, everybody is mad at you, you don't make any money, and you get frustrated.

The second thing is drone footage. Drone footage just cut our days on market by half—real property footage. It's crazy what that did. So there's a little upfront fee, and then we get a commission on the closing table, which is anything between 12 and 20 percent of the sales price, but we pay the realtor out of that. I always say take what you would pay to a realtor anyway, double it, and that's what you pay to us.

Seth: In terms of how you're paying for this drone footage or listing fees wherever you listed for sale, is that what the upfront fee is for?

Robin: Yeah, the upfront fee is around $600. It varies a little bit. There's a mini subscription, which is $149 a month. We do, for example, a daily comps call. Our clients can come daily with us and comp their properties. We do that in front of them because I think that's one of the major issues we're facing. We've got a bunch of lots that we couldn't sell because the comps were not run right.

There's a little bit of service around that because we just want to sell good deals because we make our money in the back end. So I'm an investor in the deal in that moment where I take it because I get my money when we close.

Seth: This is a huge topic to spend a little bit of time on. This issue of how you comp properties and even looking back at that package of a hundred plus properties you bought for 300 grand, the ability to comp properties at all and get even close to an accurate number on that. How do you do that? What is your process? Because this has everything to do with how much you should offer to buy the thing, how you plan out your profit, and all this stuff. If you don't have a reliable way to do that, which can be a tricky thing with land, you can be in big trouble. So what is your reliable method?

Robin: I agree 100% with you. I always say the sale starts with the comps we run in the beginning. To be honest, we do it manually. I have a team of two people that comp properties every day, and I train them every day. I do it personally. I don't know how many properties I've looked at in my career, but it's probably a five-figure number.

It's tough and tricky, especially when you don't know the area. When you would send me a deal—I think you're somewhere in the north, like Michigan or whatever county—and I don't know that county, you can go with averages and what you see. The tricky thing about land listing in the comping process is you just have two data points compared to houses. With houses, you know the year when it was remodeled, the number of bedrooms and bathrooms, the veranda, the garage, and so on. With land, you literally have two data points: acreage and price. The rest of the information you need to get out of the listing text and the pictures. In the pictures, you see utilities; you maybe see what has been done in the past. So it's pretty limited.

Robin: Normally, what we do is we go in that area and look for comparable comps from our side—like four sold comps and three for-sale comps—to build pricing scenarios where we see what the trend is in that area. Second, we look into the market too—how many are listed, how many sold in the past 12 months, six months, 90 days—break that down, and how has the market developed?

This is what we do on our end for every property when we onboard it, and we have a second comps confirmation when we engage the realtor. For all of our clients, we engage with the local realtor. We have a huge process in place to win these realtors, qualify them, and they always need to have experience in land. Then we ask them for their opinion because they are the local experts; they're the people with feet on the ground.

The better you comp, the more money you will make on the deal, the better you will make offers—you will know your boundaries for what you can make on offers. An interesting thing we've seen throughout this year was that everything you list today, your comps are probably half a year old because you made that offer half a year ago. But half a year later, now we see a doubling in days on market across the country and 20% price decreases across the country.

Run your comps. I guess that's the biggest thing I can tell you. Run your comps today before you start any listing activities and be really specific; spend some time. And what I see a lot with land investors—I don't know if you see that too—they do deals everywhere, right? They do one here, one there. I still do deals until today in like six or seven counties. Five of them are in Florida, two are in Texas, and I've been there. I know every road. I know every subdivision. So when you send me something, I will know what's going on there.

So I think that's the second tip: when you have good areas, get deep, go deep, learn to know, spend some time there, meet some realtors, some builders and all that, so you know how your area is working.

Seth: So when you go through your first round or two of looking for these comps, the sold comps, the listed comps and all that stuff, but then you end up talking to a realtor—and it sounds like that's kind of the real test to be like, how close were we based on what they said? What if you find a realtor and you don't agree with what they're saying? You ascertain that they don't know what they're talking about? We trust our comps more? Or maybe a better question is, in the end, when you go full circle and these things actually sell, how often do you end up being wrong, either too high or too low with your valuation?

Robin: Meanwhile, we're pretty good at that. I think we have like an over 90% success rate. I mean, we're talking maybe about a 10-15% difference, which is normal. In the beginning, that was a huge deal because we just relied on the land investors. This is what you learn when you start selling for other people—you have a completely different underwriting than they have. And I see that a lot of people just throw whatever contract they have out there or they buy the property blind and then sit on something that is a liability and not an asset.

This is why I can just encourage everybody to really spend time on their research before they list something. Because no matter if you do listing with us or you do it by yourself, you start spending time, and it costs you money. You start listing; it costs you money. And all the hope you destroy when you get to the closing table or when you don't generate leads and then you need to reduce pricing, pricing, pricing—this is the most important thing—that you know from the beginning what your property is worth and dive into it.

And like you said, it's a weak topic. There's no 100% reliable data. You can just throw it out there and then see how the market is reacting to your pricing for this property.

Seth: So when you get a property—I don't know, let's just hypothetically say it's 10 acres; it's got really unique characteristics; maybe it's like on a hill next to a lake with nice road access, and there is literally nothing like that in a 10-mile radius, like it just doesn't exist; it's one of a kind—how do you go about figuring out what a real market value is? Like when there are no comps, do you just skip forward to the realtor and just hope they're right?

Robin: We do our first round of comps and we rely on that before we take over a deal. Like I said, as soon as I start marketing, I put money into that deal personally. When you give me a lot to sell for you, and the moment we submit it, I burn all the money because the $600 just for drone footage is gone. When we see the comps are not working out, then we pass. When we see unique features like water or a view, we evaluate all of that in due diligence. We look at focal points; we look at features in the area, like what's unique about this property. The due diligence team already provides this framework to our marketing team for how they market.

Then we rely on the realtor. And it depends on the price point too. When it's a $15,000 property, we just say, You know what? There's not enough spread; let's walk away. But when it's a $150,000 or $200,000 property, it's a nice profit for our partner; nice money we make too, so we dig a little bit deeper and put some more effort.

But I think the 100% security of what's going on, you get it in that moment where you hit the market and see what the market gives back. Because the property will sell for three things—when the price matches the condition of the property and the demand in the market. And most of the time when you don't have the price right, then you have a condition issue or demand issue, and this is what you need to solve.

Seth: Are there ever times when you don't hire a realtor, or is it just across the board every time there will always be a realtor involved?

Robin: We don't do it for properties under $10,000 because it's not worth it to sell these properties through their channels and find a realtor. But over $10,000-12,000—so $10,000 is our limit at the bottom—but over that, you always need to see it like this: a realtor is two things. It's a marketing and a sales channel, so you have somebody with feet on the ground that knows the local environment, that has buyers, that has the MLS.

Robin: When you have a good realtor with a good buyers list—but let's be honest, that's 0.001% of realtors that really know their stuff, especially in land. When you're in the land business, you want to turn fast, no matter if you're wholesale or if you buy it, because when you sit on inventory, it costs you money. So it's about bringing your days on market down.

With the realtor, even your online leads, you need to qualify them; you need to generate them. And when they're qualified, you match them with your realtor. And what a different conversation that is, when you can say, "Hey Seth, you know, the property is beautiful. Here, I sent you a spreadsheet, there is a Google Maps link, just go out there on the weekend with your wife." Versus where you can say, "Hey Seth, no big deal. Meet my buddy Kevin; he's our local realtor on the property Saturday morning at 10 a.m." Completely different dynamic, right? You are not suddenly the wholesaler anymore with no trust and all that. You have somebody there.

And the realtor is happy too when you structure the marketing around them. So I think it's a big, big plus to hire them. Where they struggle with this owner financing, there's a lot of explanation around that you need to do with them. But other than that, I would say that's my first recommendation when you market—you probably hire a realtor and spend that time on finding them because it's the sales and the marketing channel at the same time.

Seth: That's another good tangent to this whole conversation of value and selling and that kind of thing, because a realtor plays just a crucial role, not only in understanding the possible value but also like getting the things sold and all this stuff. And I'm sure with all the realtors you've worked with, you've probably encountered your share of bad realtors, right? I mean, that's just inevitably going to happen. I guess in order to find a good realtor or when they turn out to be bad and you look back on it, what ends up being the thing that you could have caught to tell, okay, they're not a good realtor? Like, I shouldn't hire them. In hindsight, it's obvious, but I didn't realize it back then. Are there any red flags you look for to know that you're getting a bad one or a good one?

Robin: I think the most important thing is—and probably you have heard that a lot—that they answer the phone when you call them or reply to you in a timely, reasonable manner. Other than that, we look for some experience and we ask them the question, "Can you reach that property in 24 hours when somebody wants to see your property with you?"

We ask a little bit about their land background too. We have, meanwhile, an internal realtor team that hires the realtors because they go as an agent to an agent and speak as agents to agents. It's one lady; she just gets that up and she knows how agents think, how they are, and what they're looking for. She can have the conversations with the brokers and all that.

Robin: Generally, you find a realtor for every property when you do your homework on the front end. The contract is the most important thing you need to have with your seller in place when you're a wholesaler. That contract has to have EMD and closing dates; they want to have some money in there. And then it's just like, “Who doesn't find a realtor who didn't search hard enough?” Like we have a system meanwhile, but until we had that, we called 90 realtors on average for each property until we found the right one.

Seth: Wow. How long do you have to commit to these realtors? Like, is it six months? Do you have any wiggle room to get out of that sooner?

Robin: Yeah, we have six months. And we always have a cancellation policy when our property gets canceled. Like with our partners, then it gets canceled. We're so confident—we did that in the beginning—we put a clause in there that we can cancel anytime for non-performance. There was a certain amount of leads not hit. I think that was the first version.

After that, I said, “You know what? We need to provide leads for the realtor that are qualified so they have fun.” Because when you run the math, let's say it's a $50,000 land transaction. Let's say you pay 10% in commission to your agent, right? That's the sales agent. Now there's the whole MLS regulation meanwhile, which complicates the game even more.

We were a niche with land wholesaling or land selling before already. Now it gets even harder because the old rule was like the seller's agent pays the buyer's agent. A lot of realtors still do that. So run the math: $50,000, 10%, that's $5,000. Now they need to share their $5,000 with the other agent—$2,500. Now they need to give maybe, let's say, 40% of that to the broker. So that's $1,000. So they end up with $1,500 in their pocket on these transactions, with the same amount of work they would have done with a $300,000, $400,000, or $500,000 house.

And this is how you need to think, I think, when you engage realtors. How can I make their life easier? How can I make them want to engage with me? How can I serve them? And this is what we have, I think, really good meanwhile—really providing them with value. We prepare all the listings for them. We give them everything they need. We do the due diligence. We give them the financing terms. We provide them with leads. We warm other realtors in that area for them and say, "Hey, that's our agent. Here's a property for sale." We give them emails for their buyer's list they can send. So for them, it's just plugging in, click and playing, waiting until the phone rings because everything else is prepared. And they just can really concentrate on one thing they're there for—to meet buyers on the property and sign contracts. This is how you need to see that.

Seth: How often does it happen where an operator brings a deal to you and they're like, "I've got this property; it needs to sell for this price," and it's just either a little off or it's way off? Do you go ahead and list it at that price? Or do you say, "No, we're not going to do that. If you're going to list it with us, you have to lower it to this"?

Robin: The latter. We give the recommendation during our comps check when we onboard that property, and when we check the comps and find it off, we play it back. We say, "Hey, we can't do it. Lower the price, renegotiate with the seller, do whatever, but we can't list it." Because, like I said, I put money in that deal the moment I onboarded it. So we put a price breaking point on there, and that's what it is. And you can be grateful when you find out at this point because you don't spend any hours, dollars, and hope anymore on that property where you just made the mistake up front, which is totally fine—that happened to all of us.

Seth: Now you mentioned seller financing a little bit earlier and getting realtors to work with that. I guess a couple questions here. The first thing is, how important is it that the operator is willing to sell with seller financing? Like, how big of a deal is that? Does it increase the speed to sell by two times or something, or just their willingness to go there—is that a big deal?

Robin: If they're not willing to do that, we'll still do it, but we encourage them to do it because through the network we have in the back end, through all funding sources, we buy notes on the closing table. In the end, it's just a numbers game.

First of all, properties under $50,000 sell 80% on owner financing. So when you don't offer owner financing, you just have an 80% smaller buyer pool.

Seth: You said that's $50,000 and under?

Robin: Under $50,000. And then it gets like 50 to $150,000; you have around 50% of the transactions. Over that, over $150,000; most of that is cash. Let's be honest—these are hunting properties, recreational tracts, and luxury tracts for luxury properties.

But when you're in the range of properties up to $150,000, it's a must to offer owner financing. Everybody's talking about realtors and title companies—you need your team. I think in today's market, you need a team of hard money lenders and note buyers. And to be honest, when you create notes that make 30% and 15% ROI a year, I guess there are a bunch of people in your network that—this is where I would ask first—would take over those notes and get paid every month. You need a money team too in this market.

I mean, for our clients, we can solve that through the network I have and through our land fund. That's a secret sauce—just to bring your turnaround times down and sell it on time.

Seth: And on that whole note, so, like, when we say seller financing, what are we talking about? Does this mean nothing down, like payments over 10 years, or is it like 50% down, 12% interest? When you hear seller financing, what are the numbers that pop into your head in terms of what those terms are supposed to be?

Robin: Everything up to $10,000-12,000; you want to have $99 down, like nothing down, and you want to structure your payment around $250 a month. People financing that land are in need of something. They don't have huge down payments and all that.

You do go for a land contract, a contract for deed, because it's easy for you to foreclose on. You collect the payments, they default, and you just market it again. It's nice money. And man, I hold over 200 of these little notes and they're nice because they just cashflow you every month. When they default, you just send them your national letter and you market it again and sell it to the next person.

Seth: I'm actually curious, on those smaller deals, what percentage of those are sold with cash? Because I know some land investors who, if it's below 20 grand or 25 grand, like they're not even going to consider seller financing. Like, "You shouldn't be buying land if you need seller financing for that." Like they take that approach. So are there a lot of cash buyers for those cheaper properties?

Robin: At $10,000-12,000, I tell you they sell 90% on terms. It's ridiculous. I don't know why. I mean, the nature of like an owner financing seller is that you want to have in your contracts clauses, like or notes like clauses that you can just use it as rural vacant land, that people can't change anything without written permission.

So then, who are the buyers of this? There are some people that want to invest in that area. There are people that maybe want to relocate there one day, or people that just shop around and say, "Oh, I can own a piece of land for $99 and $200 bucks a month for 10 years? Nice, let me do that."

That's what we figured out—it's $99 down, around $200 more or less—that's what everybody can afford. And I mean, we're charging interest rates around 15% no matter what state it is. We never got sued—we've produced hundreds and hundreds of notes so far. Because somebody who is defaulting on a $10,000 land will not sue you because he doesn't have $200 for a payment, so he will not have any money for an attorney.

Robin: But over that, how we structure it—like $15,000 plus—you get acceptance problems with the contract for deeds and land contracts. People want to have ownership. And how we normally structure that is mortgage and note or deed of trust and note, depending on the state. When you want to work with note buyers on these deals, you want to have 20% down. That's what they're looking for. You want to have any kind of double-digit return. I do 15%, but it could be 12% or 11% because the note buyer doesn't look so much at the interest rate every year. They look at how much they buy your note discounted that they reach their ROI they want to make.

So 20% down, double-digit interest. And you always want to have a loan servicing fee included—anything between $35 and $45 in your paperwork—because a professional note buyer will offload their papers to a note service. When you hold the note by yourself, by the way, that's great—when you do $45 a month, it's $45 in your pocket for setting up your landloans.com or whatever that is.

Seth: Interesting thing about that—so I interviewed Pat Porter; he's a pretty well-known land real estate agent in Louisiana and works in several states. And we got into this issue of seller financing and how it's hard to get bank financing for land. And he was like, "What are you talking about? Like 90% of our buyers get bank financing."

And it was just totally backwards from everything I'd ever heard. I was like, what? But apparently a lot of banks will lend on that higher-value stuff, whether it's like hunting land or farmland. It probably, I'm sure, depends on the uses and the borrower and their financial wellbeing and all that stuff. And he didn't tell me this, but I'm half wondering if he has like a bunch of different bankers in his back pocket where it's like, "Hey, you need cash? Talk to this banker. They lend on land."

I almost wonder if that might make sense for you to do—like, get a bunch of these bankers that you know are going to lend on land just to make it easy, get people's cash.

Robin: Yeah, it makes sense. But, you know, as soon as you get into that thing, you have an underwriting problem. Somebody financing a $20,000 property with you will probably not have the credit score, nor the bank industry, nor the job, nor any kind of financial statements that will allow them to take $20,000 out.

Seth: Yeah, and I think with Pat, a lot of his properties are the higher end, like, probably 50 grand and over range. So that's his frame of context where he's saying that kind of thing. I don't want to speak for Pat. Pat, if you're listening to this, sorry if I'm getting this wrong. But I believe that's where he was coming from.

Robin: No, I mean, it's available, especially there's smaller credit unions that do that. We're working on a project right now—it's 45 acres here in Texas on the lake. And the local bank will finance it. But hey, you need to go through a loan approval process. You need to bring your financial statements. You need to have somebody personally guaranteeing the loan. It's just a huge headache.

I think the great thing is that when you structure your owner financing, we don't underwrite the buyer; we underwrite the property. This is how I look at that. The buyer—like when you have 20% down, you already have 20% equity in that deal. Then when you sell the note at a little discount, then you have like 30% or 35% equity in that deal when that buyer defaults.

We work on all the paperwork with our buyers, most of the time with the deed in lieu. That means in case they default, you don't need to go through a foreclosure process. They sign that with closing. And when you define in the note, "Hey, when you're three months behind, we can execute that and we get control over the property." And suddenly, when it's a hundred thousand dollar property you're sitting on, you bought it maybe for 65—so as a note investor, now I have control over $65,000 over a $100,000 asset, so I will get my money back.

But as a land investor, like this 20% and then being prepared, a little bit discounting the note—so I would say put your owner financing price a little higher than the cash price. This is how we advertise a lot of stuff: "Hey, we sell for $100,000 with 20% down and these monthly terms, or get a 20% cash discount and buy it for $80,000."

Seth: My friend Peter Nukasani—and you might know him—does a very similar thing where he buys lots of land from wholesalers, usually smaller, cheaper stuff, and sells it with owner financing. And there's always two prices on his listings. A common thing that I saw on his website is that when you buy with seller financing, the price is basically twice as much when you consider all the interest, all the payments, all this stuff. And if you buy it for cash, it's half of what it ends up being for the owner financing version.

Robin: And you know, when you're structuring the notes, right? I personally just hold the small notes. I sell all of the big ones to have cash flow in the company. I mean, what we do all costs money. And when you structure just the deal right, and you have this $100,000 and you would sell it cash for $80,000, you buy it for $50,000—it's almost the same. Like when you sell that note, let's say for $65,000 or something like that, instead of $80,000, you have $85,000. You're receiving cash, a little bit more closing costs, but often the times it ends up the same or leaving a little bit more than when you would have made a cash sale. You have more buyers. It makes more sense. Everybody is happy. And I love these win-win-win-win-win situations that are created out of this.

Seth: So looking at your website here, again, onlinelandmarket.com, I see you have listings here, but you're also listing this with realtors. So do you always make a practice of listing stuff there along with what the realtor does? Or are these just the ones that you don't use realtors for?

Robin: We do both. So when you onboard a property, we do all the underwriting. We talked about that a lot—like the comps and the title commitment. We check your contract too, because we just figured out that a lot of the contracts we receive are just not good enough. We do due diligence, and in the end, we order the drone footage and we prepare like five types of listings.

There's a listing for the MLS, one for Facebook Marketplace, one for our website, one for land.com, because we just split tested a lot what's working and what's not. When you do Facebook Marketplace, you need to list in a certain way that you don't get banned permanently.

Land.com, we made a project with them, we have a pretty big subscription with them, and our leads dropped by 50%. Then we made a project with them to see what lists fast—like, how can you do that? And we started changing images and looking at how many leads are generated, and out of that, we doubled the amount of leads in the end.

So it's just five types of listing images we create, and then it's just a spread. I'm a big believer in omni-channel marketing. We find the realtor, so we have the MLS solved, and we have the local buyers solved. We list it on land.com, which is for me one of the strongest lead bringers in the industry right now. A lot of people are unhappy with it or whatever—they just change their algorithms like Google and Facebook. So when they change their algorithm, you need to do something.

We do landflip.com, landsearch.com, we list it on our own website; we run social media ads on Facebook, Instagram, and TikTok. We list it on Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok. We do YouTube, we do neighborhood marketing, and we do cash buyers list marketing.

Seth: You send neighbor letters? Is that like a standard thing you always do—neighbor letters?

Robin: Yeah.

Seth: So I guess if you end up finding the buyer and selling these things and a realtor's involved, you end up paying that realtor's commission regardless of who ended up finding the buyer, right?

Robin: So here's the deal with that—we do all these amazing things. We have email marketing; like everything you want to do, we do it. We do Facebook Marketplace, all that stuff. And now we have a gigantic funnel. We are out there in the world. And all these people come in.

What I see people doing now is dropping off all these leads to a realtor. But all these online leads you generate, no realtor will deal with that. They will not call the people. Online leads, you need to engage them in 15 minutes. Otherwise, they're dead. This is statistics: 85% less is the chance that you ever reach somebody after 15 minutes.

So that means when you spend $10,000 in marketing and you don't crack your 15 minutes, you have like $8,500, which is just gone. So we take all these inbound leads, we qualify them on time, and we have an in-house sales team.

And now here there's a couple of different scenarios. We reach out—it's most of the time an appointment center that qualifies the buyer. Meanwhile, it's an AI but that qualifies the buyers. So when they're qualified, they get an appointment scheduled with our sales rep, and the sales rep then goes deeper into that, like "Hey, blah, blah, blah," and if they really want to buy the property, our sales rep takes that hot lead that's qualified, that knows everything already, and schedules an appointment for the realtor. So he funnels that lead to the realtor that meets the people on site and then closes.

Sometimes they sell it on the phone too, and sometimes the realtor sells it through his sources. So we have three scenarios. In all scenarios, we always pay the realtor. Even when we sell it on the phone, they still get a commission—it's a little bit lower than when they are involved. When we sell it on the phone, because they had work and when you always give them something, they did work in between that they didn't sell. You want to add them as part of your team because with the next sale, you will need a realtor.

Seth: Quick question: I appreciate you talking about engaging the buyer within 15 minutes. I think that's a really important point for a lot of people to understand. When you say engage the buyer, what does engage mean? Is that just like replying to the message or is it a phone call, email or just something to show that you're alive?

Robin: It's both. You want to actually start a conversation. This is what the engagement means. I'm happy you clarified that. Of course, when somebody is scrolling through at 2 AM Saturday night, you will not call them because probably they're lying in bed next to their wife or the wife lies next to her husband or whatever it is. You don't want to call them.

So in after hours, we have like a text message chatbot, which is an intelligent AI bot, and it starts the conversations to qualify them with the goal to schedule you an appointment. If it's normal times, daytime like 9 to 7 or 9 to 8 in the moment, we just call them right away in just 15 minutes.

Seth: This is another fascinating thing—this conversational AI bot that qualifies the buyers. So is this a bot that you created, and like, how does this work? Does it text them or is it like hooked up to Facebook Messenger? Or tell me more—I want to know about that.

Robin: Okay, we can have a deep dive about AI right now, but I'm the wrong person to talk about that technically. But how does it work, right? In the end, AI is about prompting. This is what we know. You need to have prompts for everything, you know, for ChatGPT. And in the same way, you can build a prompt for like a conversational AI tool that you can teach things, like what to ask, how to reply, or where to find things, and connect them with your database. Like our AI bot can talk with our database.

So when you call in, they can scan the database and you give them a couple of keywords. Hey, I'm looking for these two acres in Lehigh Acres, Florida. It can identify that. It's a script in the back end—it's a script you would give your appointment setter to do in a really advanced way. And then you just have software executing that. And there are different ones. I think we're using Blend AI right now for that purpose.

Seth: The interesting thing is, I was just thinking, Okay, well, it's just a script. Why don't we give the script a text message bot too? Does this only work with texting or does it work with literally any written medium? Like, if somebody sends an email, will it reply to the email? Like, where does it not work? I guess it's texting and calls, right?

Robin: So conversational AI means for me, like it calls you, and to be honest, it's crazy amazing. Like it calls you with an audible voice that you hear—an actual voice. And to be honest, with the technology so far, people don't even realize it's an AI right now. It's so fluent and so fast and so nice.

And it's an inbound call so you don't have any compliance issues—it's an inbound lead, it's an opted-in lead. So you call them and say, "Hey, I'm your smart assistant Sofia, and I just want to talk to you about your inquiry for this property." It's like your appointment center calling somebody or your appointment setter texting somebody. You teach it once and it's working 24/7, and then you can script the calls again. Let's have smarter people than me do that, but I would spend my money there because, like these AI developers, you can build something out like this for two, three, four, or five thousand dollars. But when you spend five, six thousand dollars in marketing, maybe a month, it's worth it.

And you can also integrate that on the acquisition side—that's what we do too, just to be fast of service.

Seth: Is this bot effectively just getting some standard questions answered just to make sure that the buyer fits a certain profile? Like whatever the questions would be, but they just want to make sure that you're talking to a real legit buyer who actually can do something?

Robin: I think we ask for money; we ask like, "Hey, when are you able to visit the property? Can you go there? Why are you buying that property?" It's like five questions, I think; they try to get out of there. And when the data are all green, they schedule automatically. They link with the calendar of the sales rep, and they put an appointment on the calendar.

It's pretty amazing, man. When they showed me that, I was like, "Are you kidding me? That's crazy!"

Seth: I remember hearing a lot about this like a year ago, and then it just kind of stopped. And I think it's because, what is it, the TCPA or whatever the government agency is, says that you can't use this for cold calling. But you're right—this isn't cold calling. This is somebody who reached out to you first.

Robin: You don't hear about that anymore because nobody's talking about dispositions in land. That's like an industry problem, I think. Everyone's talking about acquisition and what you can do—"I can get more deals." I mean, nobody's doing it; what do you need to do on the back end? I was with Kendall—you know Kendall too, right? I was with Kendall on the podcast and said, "Robin, I never thought about putting a budget on dispositions."

And that's what it is—you need to budget dispositions. You need to think about them. And we have opted-in leads—we interact with them. These are leads where people gave the consent that we can contact them because they inquired about one of the properties we're selling, so there's no big compliance issue.

Seth: Yeah, I think you're right. Acquisitions has been the talk that everybody's getting after, but I think that may be changing. At least the past couple land events I've been at, dispositions is where people are feeling the pain the most, at least right now at this point in time. I think it's just been so easy for so long that when there's even the slightest bit of slowdown, people are like, "Whoa, the sky is falling."

Whereas when I got into land, like selling was the hardest thing ever back in 2009. Like it was the norm for stuff to sit on the market for nine-plus months. So I'm totally comfortable with it. But a lot of people who got into this in 2020 and after, it's like a new thing for them.

I am curious—how often does it happen where, like, a property just won't sell when you're listing it, and like, what do you do? Maybe it's got some weird problem like no access or wetlands or there's some obvious problem with it. Do you just kind of go back to the operator and say, "Sorry, it's been six months; we can't do it; you're on your own"? Do you just kind of let them re-up and list it for as long as possible? Or how do you handle those issues when properties sell really slowly?

Robin: We filtered that before. You mentioned two obvious reasons: wetlands, no access. When we see that, we stay away from it. We don't list it because it's so hard to sell it. I think, and this is where I want to encourage everybody, when you buy a piece of land, when you acquire it, when you have it, look at it as a buyer would.

We were looking this morning—we run every day a comps call in the morning when people bring their deals, and I pull my map and run them. So I pulled it up and looked at this—it's Michigan. It's like a beautiful property on the first sight, like beautiful trees, five acres—that's what you want. And I had like on Land ID the wetlands filter—it's 90% wetlands.

I said, "You know what? I will stay away from it." Look here where they build houses—everywhere is high and dry, but nowhere where it's wetlands. The only chance you really have is to make a quick shot at the neighbors and see if they want to buy it. But other than that, that's not a deal.

Same for road access. I mean, you can get road access; you can get three easements. I'm right now in a deal in Florida—we're in there for two and a half years because the court appointments are so hard to get and all that. I just stay away from that.

So that's why we do a really good underwriting with the comps in the back and front end. Properties don't close most of the time because the comps aren't right. You have a condition issue, which we find out pretty soon because we always have somebody walking the property in our due diligence process too. And the third thing is title issues, and we solve all those things pretty well up front. So like in the beginning, it happened a lot and then we learned and evolved for our customers because you and me both want deals that sell.

Seth: So you're doing like a title search on properties before you list them? Or how do you know about these title issues?

Robin: Title commitment. So we go to actually a title company and say, "Hey, I want to close on a property—just get me a title commitment if I'll close tomorrow with you. What will be on there? What do we need to solve?" I mean, land titles—you know that probably better than anybody else—it was like before that; I think two out of ten have non-solvable title issues. Sometimes they are solvable but they're economically not solvable; does that make sense? It doesn't make money-wise sense.

Seth: So you basically just preemptively get that title commitment. Like you're not actually going to close but just like, "Hey, when this sells in six months, we're going to go with you. Give us the title commitment now." And then that's how you can see without paying anything up front, right?

Robin: Yeah, that's it. That's part of the fee we charge up front. When that falls out, we cover that from there, but then you know and don't burn money on the way. That's how you always need to see that—always when you touch things, you burn money. And we want to prevent our partners from burning money because we burn money with that. That's just the thing.

Seth: You mentioned a while back that like you post videos on TikTok and YouTube and Instagram and all this stuff, and this idea of video—how important is video? What if you could get only a video or only pictures? I know it's a ridiculous question because that would never happen, but just trying to gauge, like, which do you think is more important and how big of a role does video play these days in selling land?

Robin: That's a hard question. We never made a test on that—probably should do that. I just think marketing needs to be emotional. You can show a video—it's moving pictures; you can show around; you can put some music on that. Because, you know, with land you don't have this personal attachment like with houses. We're closing on a house this Friday—we have a personal attachment; we're going to live there; we're going to raise our daughter there. With a piece of land, there is not that attachment, so you need to bring that kind of emotion somehow in there.

It's attention-seeking. I don't know if we ever directly sold something through those videos, but the people come into your universe. You make them attentive to yourself. They see, "Oh, that guy has nice lots. Oh, I want to have a look. Oh, new videos. Oh, I'm looking in that area. Look, that lot looks nice."

And it's always about competition, too. When you do better stuff than your competition, who do they trust more? I'm in a mastermind with some of the biggest marketing agencies out of the U.S. People have a trust problem nowadays. They don't trust media anymore. So you need to even do more so that they trust you. And with a video, with moving pictures, with real footage of the property, you solve that trust issue because suddenly you're not like a voice on the phone.

We're doing a test with our sales team right now where we schedule Zoom calls with the buyers. It's been running for a week now and a lot of people like it. Like, "Hey, let's hop on a call real quick. I can show you around the property on the screen and we can see each other." It's a completely different level of trust. It's not just a voice calling you on the phone—you don't have a face.

Seth: That would be interesting if you could ever set up some kind of tracking to figure out, and maybe you already have some insight in this, but like when you consider, okay, I've got this listing we're posting on YouTube and Instagram and TikTok and land.com and Facebook marketplace and then the MLS and then this and that and on and on it goes—if you could only list in one of those places, besides the MLS, what would that one place be? What do you get the most bang for your buck?

Robin: It depends on the property type. Let me say it like this, but the lead sources that make the strongest difference are Land.com and Facebook Marketplace. It shifted a lot. Last year, we sold like 65% of our properties with the realtor in the end, comes through a source from the realtor. This year, it shifted—it's like we sell 70% directly, 30% through the realtors.

Robin: And then in the past two months, we shifted the realtor model a little bit, provided them with more leads, and did more advertising for them, so it seems like when I look at the end of December, it will be again a 50-50 split. But when we now look at this 70%—I looked at the numbers once a quarter because I always want to see a trend—from the transactions that sold, actually it was 35% from Land.com, 30% from Facebook Marketplace leads, and the other 35% from everything else.

I mean, buyers lists are pretty important because sometimes you funnel somebody from Land.com for their property and they're in your email marketing, and then they reach out in half a year. That's a statistic we have from leads coming from other sources—they stick with us half a year and then they buy. But Land.com and Facebook Marketplace are the strongest sources for leads right now; that's what we see.

Seth: Do you list stuff on LandSearch and Craigslist?

Robin: We do LandSearch now, since like three weeks ago, so I can't tell you anything about that. We don't do Craigslist. We made a test on that—on the bigger properties it didn't work out in any way. On the smaller properties, it worked out a little bit, but the problem is it was just too much work to maintain it. You need to make like a calculation—how much effort do I put in, how much does it need to generate? And it was just not worth it.

Because part of me always, when I think through those kinds of questions, I always wonder, well, maybe it's one of those things where the grass is greener where you water it, you know? So like, yeah, Land.com is doing well because you're putting a lot into Land.com. That's why I asked the question. But a few minutes ago, you were talking about how you send more leads to your realtors or you advertise—do you ever pay to boost ads or do paid ads on any platform?

Robin: We run social media campaigns like Meta and Google ads for our buyers lists. When we have a subdivision, we even run separate ads if we have 10-12 lots in one area. But the better way we found out is by running your buyers lists and then doing really good email marketing. That's the more cost-efficient way of doing it.

I think the problem with Facebook Marketplace is it's not a reliable, scalable marketing source because they can just ban you any day. I mean, we met like last time on RJ's event, the Land Investing Summit there—I talked to a couple of guys and they run 15 computers with C-Mobile boxes and VPNs and all that stuff. And we try to do that too.

Robin: Meanwhile, I run like an ambassador program. And this is how we solve that. I mean, we have a pretty good guideline of what we can do on Facebook Marketplace and what not. So we just find people that have Facebook Marketplace accounts that want to make a couple extra bucks every month. And we pay them on a per-lead basis and a little bit when we close on the property. That is our solution for that. I think it's 12 or 13 people right now that have Facebook Marketplace because when they get banned, it's sad for them, but I have a pipeline with the next Facebook Marketplace account ready.

Seth: Do you know what it is that's getting people banned?

Robin: Yeah, it's certain keywords. "Pwner"financing," everything with "finance" is like that. It's using the wrong pictures a lot—you don't want to have a lot of advertising. You want to have not more than three to five pictures, which is what we normally do, and it's original pictures. It's most of the time drone footage we try to use. And we try to keep every account with not more than three to five land listings at the same time. We rotate them too and take them out. The intention of Facebook Marketplace is that you and me sell our crap out of our garage, right? And this is how you need to sell your land there.

Seth: Do you ever post in buy/sell Facebook groups? So I've heard sometimes that can be even more effective than Facebook Marketplace.

Robin: Yeah, we have like a team that's doing that too—VAs doing that. You can't automate it. It's one person—it's pretty strong strategy too. You can't scale it that much either, but when you're on your own, like you work one market, two, or three markets, that's what I would do. This is what I did in the beginning—I'm really being in one market and you know the groups there. I was a lot in Tallahassee in that area of Florida—there's Tallahassee garage sale and yard sale and whatever.

Seth: I am curious: what makes a good listing? And is there a difference between what makes a good listing on Land.com versus Facebook? Like, is it just a copy and paste, same picture, same everything? Or if you see a terrible listing out there, what makes it terrible? There's probably a million different things. But what boxes do you have to check or what does it need to look like for you to know, yes, this is as effective as we can make it?

Robin: I think real footage is the first thing. You see a lot of land listings that are like stock pictures from everywhere. When it's not drone footage, you can always get somebody local walking the property, making some pictures, getting a good overview of the neighborhood—where it is, how it looks, access to the property. Really important—people need to know where it is when they go there.

On Land.com, for example, it's a lot of real footage, beautiful things like the flyovers and showing the neighborhoods—that works there. You can't do that on Facebook. On Facebook, you want to have three to five simple images; show a little bit. It needs to look a little bit sketchy and unprofessional because you want to be an unprofessional reseller.

Our website listings have a lot of the surroundings, like different pins and all that—what you know from a normal land listing. A lot of advertising in the pictures too, but on Land.com that doesn't work—people don't like it that much. So you want to show the neighborhood a little bit, like where's the next Walmart and all that, but you don't want to have like on everything, "Hey, this is a $100,000 property for $80,000 in cash!" You know those ads. On Land.com, you don't want to be flashy. On Facebook Marketplace, you don't want to be too flashy too because they will ban you, even if it works.

Seth: I guess that's the question—it's a lot of testing what works for you too. We still test all the time, right? But getting people an understanding of the property and where it is—I think that's the most important thing. I know one of the most annoying things for me when I'm trying to sell land is tire kickers—just like answering endless questions for people who aren't serious; they're not going to do anything; talking to them on the phone; it goes nowhere.

How do you avoid these people? Or is there something you can say to get a buyer to commit to pulling the trigger? Or, like, don't spend time with them until you know they're serious? And if so, like, how do you do that?

Robin: I think the strongest question you need to ask is, "When are you able to visit the property?" Oh, "I need to see..." Okay, you're not qualified. "Hey, I sent you the thing, bye bye, go in my follow-up funnel."

When people make an effort on visiting a land property, seeing a realtor on the property or whatever, then I think they're qualified. Also like the question, "Hey, are you interested in an installment sale or do you want to buy on terms, or do you want to buy cash? Could you make the down payment like tomorrow after you visited the property?" So you want to ask about their financial situation and how urgent it is, and are they willing to put some effort in? I think this is how you qualify really fast, and then you can say yes or no. And I mean, better you say no than yes to the wrong people.

Seth: Sometimes I'm selling properties to people who don't see it before they buy it—they're in some other state, like they're just kind of making some emotional decision to do it. So, like, if I made them visit before talking more, that would kick out a qualified buyer. Is that always the right thing to ask, or is there a different way you could phrase it or what do you think?

Robin: That's not black and white, I guess. But what is black and white is you need to maybe work with statistics—most of the time the people will tell you, "I can do it" or "I can't do it." Obviously, let's see if we can get three questions answered. The first is "Why do you want to buy the property?" Second is "Why not?" Like, what would be the reason why you wouldn't buy it? And the third one is, "What do you and me need to do to get this deal going?"

These are the three things, and with that we have a good all-around picture, and then you test their level of commitment. And then, of course, build some urgency, build some scarcity. It's like Friday coming up, or you went over these websites; there's just like two more things so you better grab it and play a little bit with that.

Seth: Those are great questions. Appreciate that. Two more questions for you, and then we're done. Appreciate your time very much.

So when I heard you talking at the Land Scaling Summit, I think it was you; you said something to the effect that you should be doing deals where you have buyers. I'm wondering, how do you determine where you have buyers? Like, what specifically do you look for to say, yes, there are officially enough buyers here to buy this type of property?

Robin: Literally, the only thing we can really look at is the market itself. We always try to look into markets where you have a bunch of sold properties in the last 12 months, 6 months, where you see something and you don't have more than that for sale - always a little bit less, maybe 50%, 60%. Because then you know inventory will turn.

I mean, there are websites where you can do that, like Lot Hunt or Land Inside or whatever, where you can just see how fast the market is. And when you see, hey, you have like 30 properties sold in the last six months and you have like 10 listed and you see average days on market are 90, let it go. But don't go in areas where you don't see any stuff moving.

We see stuff in Florida that was gone in 30 days or in Texas like last year—it's now 60 days. When you go more rural in Tennessee, that was like 60 days before; it's now like 120 days. And what was at 20 a few days before is probably 240 now. So you need to be prepared for that.

Robin: And in the end, I think everything you do in business is go to what buyers want. I mean, you can't sell a freezer to an Eskimo—they don't need it. They just put their stuff outside. That's a classical thing. So you would sell them a heater, right? Like, that's what they really need. And this is how you should think about where you go.

Seth: Totally. So last question. I know you mentioned you've got a cash buyers list that you market to. And I'm curious, what did the most active cash buyers look like? I don't know how much you've dived into this to really understand, like the most active people who will buy the most stuff. But if you could paint a picture of who they are, how could we reverse engineer the process and find these specific types of people?

Robin: We work a lot with BuyerFinder from Jared at BuyerFinder.io—you get the data out of there. This is where we start our research, and then we have like an AI tool that scrapes people who would have the same profession or the same companies or whatever in that area, and then we organize to reach out to them.

Literally always look what your property type is—there are mobile home properties, RV properties, hunting properties—there are all kinds of different properties. Right now we're selling for some guys—they have 60 lots; they are subdividers in Mississippi. And I look at the products and these products are mobile home lots over and over, so we started a massive reach out to the mobile home sellers in that area—like Clayton or whatever—the representatives of Clayton. Because these people have a product like a mobile home and they need land for it, they organize the whole financing of that thing. They're like cash buyers—they organize the whole project for that end buyer.

So always think about who would buy that land. That can be a builder, a developer, that can be mobile home people, that can be RV people or whatever.

Seth: Awesome. Cool. Well, Robin, again, thanks for your time. Totally appreciate you sharing your wisdom with us. If people want to find out more about you, I know we've mentioned it a couple of times, but what are the different websites they should go to to learn more?

Robin: If you're a land investor and you would like to work with us in funding or dispo or whatever else, we run a community call every Thursday. It's at thelandpilot.com. We have our own Facebook group, come in there. We're around like a thousand people at the moment. It's pretty fun to call, always 30-40 people. We have brilliant people that come there and teach. The Land Pilot is like our center of everything—we have a portal in the back end where you can do your funding, where you can do your dispositions and all that. Probably the best thing.

Other than that, like Facebook is a good place to reach me—Robin Seib—or Instagram. That's where you can get me; send me a message there. We love to work with the land industry; we love it.

Thank you for having me, Seth. You're a really good interviewer. I think you have done 210 episodes, did I hear that right? And thanks for everything you do for the community too. I know that you're a huge pillar for every one of us.

Seth: Yeah, appreciate that. If you want to check out the show notes for this episode, just go to retipster.com/210. That's where you can find links to all the stuff that Robin mentioned. And again, Robin, yeah, appreciate the kind words. Appreciate you talking to me today. And I hope the listeners out there learned a lot. I know I did.

Robin: Yeah, thank you so much. And thank you for listening, spending that like one and a half hours, Jesus.

Seth: I know. Flew right by.

Robin: Maybe one last thing. If you ever want to comp a property, we run a comps call every morning. It's on the Land Pilot. You can bring it there. We can talk your deals through because this is what we really want to do, all of us, is doing deals, right? So thank you for having me and talk to you soon.